I wanted a place to discuss my handguns and firearms in general. Everyone seemingly has lots to say about guns, so I promise you this won't be a rant blog.
Last night, I installed the stealth decocker levers I got from Brignoliarmi.com. The package also came with one slide lever. I’ve opted to not change that…not sure what such a change entails but it has to be easier to install than the decocking levers were. As well, I do believe Brownells sells a plug for the right side of the gun that will have a hole where the lever would’ve been (after I swap out the old part for the new). I’m thinking on ordering that part. Anything to slim down the the profile of the PX4.
Some pics:
Before the lever swap
Before the lever swap
After the lever swap
After the lever swap
After the lever swap
After the lever swap
The packaging
Backside of the packaging
They were somewhat difficult to install. I’ve not done such a thing before. Well, let me restate that. I’ve never removed roll pins from guns that didn’t involve changing out backstraps. This wasn’t a simple backstrap change. It wasn’t super complicated, either. I used Mrgunsngear’s video to assist me in changing the parts. (Note: you do not have to remove the extractor to change out the safety levers.) The most difficult part was in getting the roll pin out. Getting it back in was easy. Another thing that stumped me was the spring…I didn’t reinstall it correctly and had to remove the roll pin again, then reinstall the spring correctly, and THEN reinstall the roll pin AGAIN.
I also might need a new punch, as the punch that I bought from Lowes was beat the hell up after the swap (bent at the tip).
Note that this does change the mode of operation for this particular gun. It was sold to me as an F Type. It is now a G Type (the new parts are labeled as G Type and the gun now functions a a G Type). Prior to the parts change, the gun’s levers functioned as both a safety and decocker (they were not dedicated to either function). The levers now function solely to decock. They will NOT safety the trigger, and the lever now springs back into place after the gun has been decocked. For me, it is easier to train with DA as a first shot than it is to train to carry cocked and locked (meaning that I’ve to ensure the safety is off before I pull the trigger, and also always ensure the safety is engaged when it’s holstered).
The gun does look cleaner, profile-wise. It also carries somewhat better, as the new levers are no longer pushing on the material of the N82 Professional holster. Still, the gun is thick.
No amount of parts replacement will change the fact that the slide is over an inch thick. This is the ONLY negative of this firearm. I’ll have to grow used to it.
The gun is definitely easier to rack with the new levers. But the gun is also difficult to decock because the new levers have less traction…it almost makes me miss the old levers.
UPDATE: The stealth slide lever is in. I installed it a few hours after I posted the above. Not sure if I like the hole that was left after removing the right side old lever. Also not sure why Beretta didn’t make replacements for both sides. (There’s only one replacement…the left side…the old right-sided lever has to come out to get the left-sided stealth one installed.)
UPDATE #2: I ordered the slide catch plug at Midwest Gunworks. The part arrived quicker than I’d anticipated. I had issues understanding how to install it. I went to a Beretta forum (berettaforum.net) to ask how PX4 owners have been installing the part. Apparently you’ve to push down and turn so that the plug locks in, only this is difficult to do. A forum user stated he’d used rubber from some gun grips to get traction on the plug without damaging it…I had a some Hogue grips and used them to turn the plug and it worked. Here’s a picture of how the gun now looks with the plug installed —
A few weeks ago, I had bought some .380 ammo locally (from Cabela’s). I’d bought Herter’s Select and some PMC Bronze. My intention was to shoot both boxes (50 rounds per box) but I ended up quitting after shooting the Herter’s.
Why?
The Plus was biting the webbing of my hand. The part between forefinger and thumb. It wasn’t slide bite but the gun’s beaver tail edges were cutting into the webbing. This was the first time I’d experienced this and I’d shot maybe 250ish out of the gun by that time…without any sharp recoil (that’s what I’m going to call it). I’d not changed how I was shooting. I was holding the gun the same way I always had.
The only thing that had changed was the ammo.
My first thought was that the ammo was hot but when I conducted some quick research on the ammo, I saw that the muzzle velocity wasn’t anything special, so maybe it wasn’t that it was hot.
Today, I took it to the range and shot the PMC out of it. This time, there was no sharp recoil. It had to have been the Herter’s ammo. I’m pretty sure that ammo was hotter than normal. The whole box. I believe it’s made in Europe and I know Europeans usually make their ammo NATO-spec. I’m just glad I now know to avoid Herter’s.
I’m now at 323 rounds through the Plus. That’s more than my XD 9 Mod 2. The Plus is my 4th most fired gun, between the aforementioned XD and the Sig Sauer SP2022.
It is now much easier to fire than when I first bought it. I used to hate how difficult it was for me to operate the gun. I hated the DA trigger, hated the manual safety, hated the decocker’s placement, and hated the safety’s non-intuitive nature (the manual safety operates the opposite of how a 1911 manual safety is operated). What’s different now? The DA trigger must’ve wore in because it’s not so difficult to actuate now (but it is long and pinches the side of my trigger finger…I’d have to wear a bandaid to negate the effect). I don’t use the manual safety at all…I use DA in place of the safety. I do use the decocker (to get into DA mode) but I only use it after racking the slide back and chambering a round. I usually don’t drill when doing this…this isn’t something I need to practice, but I do need to remember to always place the gun in DA mode.
I also published a video update on the Plus here:
I’ve only one holster for the gun, the N82 Tactical Original holster. It is a great holster. The gun will carry well no matter the holster but it carries extremely well with this particular holster. The holster is easy to put on the hip and is easy to remove. It’s a simple holster…simple is good enough for what I need at this time. I needed a holster that removes quickly.
Oh, I’m carrying Inceptor Polycase ammo with this particular firearm, too. I know that .380 JHP is known to have issues penetrating, so I wanted something that I know for a fact will always penetrate. This ammo will not have an issue penetrating, but it shouldn’t over-penetrate either. I’ve tested the ammo at the range to ensure the gun will eat it without issue…it did.
I wouldn’t mind finding different sights for this gun but I’ll wait until I’ve more rounds through the gun first. I wouldn’t mind Big Dot sights for the gun.
I didn’t have a good picture of the gun…I only had the pictures I took the day I picked up the gun from the gun shop.
I now have three extra mags for it (five total). That arrived yesterday, along with 1000 rounds of Wolf 9mm 115-grain FMJ ammo.
The N82 Tactical Professional holster also arrived. I’m not in love with it. It doesn’t fit like the one for my Bersa. The hard shell is large and bulky, because the gun is large and bulky, I guess, but my Alien Gear feels more comfortable. Because of the large shell, it is difficult to put on my hip…it’s very difficult to fit it in the gap between my body and waistband of my pants, and I’ve a good 1″+ of space. I’m trying to give it time to grow on me…it’s not really going to break in enough for me to begin to like it. It’s a shame because it’s a nice holster. I like the retention system. I like the professional look and feel of the holster. I like the way you can adjust cant. It’s just larger than I thought.
I suppose since the ammo and magazines have arrived, I’ve no excuse to not visit the range tomorrow.
My P320 subcompact grip assembly arrive today. I can already tell that it’s the better size just by gripping it in my hand. I’ll swap out the gun’s slide and FCU tomorrow and maybe use a tape measure to get measurements (I’ve no calipers).
Oh, I’m still awaiting my stealth controls to arrive. I’ve no idea when they’ll show or how they’ll show. It’ll arrive via USPS, almost certainly…I don’t know when, though. I’m thinking I might keep the PX4 as an F-type. F-type isn’t bothering me like I thought it would, since I just keep it off of safe.
If you haven’t heard yet, YouTube has pulled advertisement revenue from YouTube channels that have a focus on firearms. That means that if those channels have any type of dependence on that type of revenue, that method of attaining funds will stop.
Once again, social media companies are trying to stick it to those that believe in 2A.
I suggest you mention these to your friends. These alternatives are struggling.
There has not been much turn-out, but these were generated when Facebook began to shut down 2A-affiliated groups shortly after the Orlando shootings. People complained about it, which spawned gun-friendly social media sites such as the above, but people aren’t using them.
Come on, guys and gals…these places can be much better than Facebook or YouTube, but only if we use them.
So, I went to the range yesterday and still had issues with the Grand Power.
Well, to be honest, it was the ammo…the gun didn’t like the ammo. How do I know this? Because the PX4 had the same issue with the exact same ammo. Both guns exhibited the same problem and both had the same problem on the first round of ammo.
This choked the P11. The side of the round is flat and if you look closely, you can see rifling marks.
Here’s a different view.
The PX4 choked on this one (The pictures show two totally different rounds, each coming for a different box — the boxes have the same lot number, though).
You can see the rifling marks on the gun…this is not typical of a chambered round that was extracted.
The ammo I was using was Winchester White Box 124-grain FMJ. I’ve shot WWB from this gun many times, but this is the first time I’ve shot WWB 124-grain from it.
Now, it’s the fault of the ammo, BUT the PX4 had no problems after the first round choked it…it shot the rest without issue. The P11 had to be cleared or had to have it’s slide smacked multiple times.
The P11 was cleaned and lubed well, so the problem isn’t because it was dirty or needed lube. It was due to the gun being tight. It’s a pro of the brand but in this case, it is also a con. This is not the first time I’ve had to deal with the gun being plagued by out-of-spec ammo…it ruins a range session, especially if it’s my carry gun and I’m trying to polish my trigger skills. If I’m spending more time clearing the gun than shooting it, that’s not fun nor does it give me confidence in the gun. Now, I know this is practice ammo and I know that self defense ammo will not have such issues (far less likely than practice ammo, at least), but I can’t practice with SD ammo. Well, I could, but that would NOT be cost effective.
I’m tired of dealing with the P11’s fickleness. It is now retired from EDC duty. I retired it early out of frustration.
I still need a good holster, though. Right now I’m using one of my Alien Gear Cloak Tuck 3.0 holsters with a PX4 compact shell. It works well, but I want something that I can easily take off and put back on, so I ordered one of N82 Tactical’s Professional series holsters.
I also ordered 3 more magazines. The mags are generally expensive (but cheaper than the $50 that P11 mags cost). Beretta sells them for $40. After searching far and wide, I found that Ammo Depot had them for $22 each! The next cheapest was $33 at Tombstone Tactical.
I went to the range with the owner of a business that I’m transferring over to. I brought my own ammo but he insisted that we use his…he brought a small ammo can of Tula ammo. I shot about five mags of that from my gun. It didn’t choke at all (and the P11 didn’t choke on it either when I shot Tula from it awhile back). I was impressed with that ammo, so when I got home, I ordered 1000 rounds of Wolf from Ammo Depot. The link shows a case of 500. I ordered two of them.
I also traded guns with my new boss (he brought a Springfield XDM, the 4″ model). He shot well enough with my gun but he didn’t shoot it like he did his XDM. He said he loved the heft of the Storm. Now, I loved his gun. I haven’t shot striker-fired in awhile (I’ve several of them). I thought I would have issues with the trigger. Nope. My grouping was tight. It was just as tight as when I shoot my DA/SA guns. I might have to look into that gun. The trigger was better than what’s in my XD Mod 2.
Oh, and I also got a notice that a store now has a medium P320 subcompact grip module in stock, so I ordered that, especially since those are difficult to come by.
Lastly, I ordered stealth levers for the PX4 Storm. I ordered both the stealth safety/decocker levers and the slide catch levers. Those should arrive soon (it’s coming from a shop in Italy…I ordered from them since Beretta USA didn’t have those parts in stock). Once it arrives, I’ll convert to the G-type.
So, this next few weeks will be fun. I’ve more info to share about a recent range visit, but I’ll do that in a different blog entry (it involves the Bersa Thunder).
I took it and the Grand Power P11 to the range this evening. All I can say is, wow…
Pluses for the gun:
It shoots almost as well as the P11.
DA trigger is better.
Shot 105 round of Magtech 115-gr FMJ and Browing BPT 147-grain ammo with only one round having an issue (light strike). It loves 147-grain.
It’s sights are easier to work with than the P11’s.
Minuses for the gun:
Backstraps are extremely difficult to work with…well, not the backstraps themselves but the backstrap retention mechanism. I struggled with it when swapping backstraps.
Large backstrap is slightly warped (out of the box).
The red paint that’s on the extractor (acting like a loaded chamber indicator) looks to have come off.
Plastic guide rod.
How does the PX4 compare to the P11?
The gun is only slightly larger than the P11.
The P11’s mag holds 12 rounds. The PX4’s mag holds 15. This isn’t a huge deal, though…the P11 is sold as a sub-compact.
The takedown of the PX4 is easy. The takedown of the P11, while not exactly orthodox, is easy enough once you’ve done it a few times.
The P11 is extremely finnicky about ammo. The PX4 doesn’t appear to be as finnicky.
The P11 needs to be run wet. I’m assuming the PX4 needs to be run wet as well…they both have rotating barrels.
The P11 won’t tolerate being dirty (lots of carbon will accumulate where the barrel rotates on the frame). I believe it is more of a competition gun that just so happens to carry well. The PX4 doesn’t appear to be as fussy when it comes to being dirty.
The PX4’s controls are not conducive to carry duty, in my opinion…both the safety/decocker levers and the slide catch levers are too big and stick out well beyond the sides of the handgun. Luckily, there are OEM “stealth” levers that make the gun feel a tad bit slimmer (and less “snaggy”).
While the PX4’s sights are better than the P11’s the P11’s sights are purposely small. This means that while they’re more difficult to use, they’re more accurate when used properly. Still, I wouldn’t mind getting some night sights on the PX4.
Once I get “stealth” levers for the gun, I’ll begin to start carrying it around the house. I plan to get the N82 Tactical Professional holster to use with the PX4.
The particular gun is the F-type. I plan to convert it to the G-type. I will never use the safety and I’m used to decock-only guns (my P11 didn’t come with a decocker and I manually decock it…it comes with a safety but I never use it because it’s always in DA mode).
So, 105 rounds were shot through the gun tonight. Here’s the targets (shot from 7 yards with two types of ammo in two different weights and with two different noses).
These are the first 15 shots out of the gun. The one in the red is the first shot (DA). This is tighter than what I’m used to shooting from a new gun. The shots are more vertically-aligned than that I’ve shot with my other new guns.
I started from left top to right top, left bottom to right bottom, then focused on the center target. The first two targets’ DA shots were very close to the red. The lower left, not so much. The lower right group was extremely tight (there are 3 holes). the center shot was a bit wide.
All of these shots were DA mode. I’d shoot, then decock back to DA mode, then shoot, then decock, and so on. This is 15 rounds. All but 3 are in the red. Two of those are close. One is a flyer.
The first grouping of 15 is at the red. The second grouping is at the head. At first, I was slowly shooting the red. At the head, I tried some double-taps (slow double-taps). Again, I’m vertically aligned but spread out…IMO, not bad for double-taps. Also, note that the second group would all be in the blue if I were aiming for the body.
Similar to the target above this one, I shot two different magazines, one at the body and one at the head. I also did double-taps. The first shots of the magazines were DA shots and each landed center mass. The first grouping is vertically aligned. The second group is spread out…not sure if this was due to the ammo (was using the 147-grain BPT target ammo).
This is the P11’s target. These were rushed (45 rounds, combination of the BPT ammo and the Magtech). I thought I’d be able to eat out the red from the target…nope. But that’s probably 35 shots that are very much center mass. I was shooting relatively fast and some are double-taps. This gun rewards the wielder when basic fundamentals are applied but punishes the wielder if those fundamentals aren’t applied. I’ve mixed results here…while the group is tight, I wanted them tighter. Because I rushed, the gun punished me. Remember what I said earlier about those small sights? It applies to my aiming and shooting at this target.
All in all, this was a fun outing. I plan to take the gun out again tomorrow and maybe spend more than an hour with both of them this time. I may even take the Sig Pro to muddy up the comparison (since it is also a DA/SA polymer gun that I think I may carry).
Stay tuned!
UPDATE: I got impatient in waiting for Beretta to stock up. I did some research and found that there’s a store in Italy that sells both the stealth slide catch and stealth safety. The site is here. The part is here. I know I have the right part because I compared the part numbers between it and Beretta’s USA site…they are the same (part no. E00348). It costs 54,92 EU and 18 EU for shipping, for a total of 72,92 EU. It’s a few dollars less than if I ordered from Beretta USA, but as far as I know, this site has them in stock.
I received the Alien Gear holster shell for the SP2022. I used the compact backing from the Sig P320 holster that I have. The gun carries well but is quite a big bulkier than my Grand Power P11. I’ve adjusted the cant so that it’s leaning forward, which helps a bit in hiding the longer grip.
I received the Alien Gear holster shell for the SP2022. I used the compact backing from the Sig P320 holster that I have. The gun carries well but is quite a big bulkier than my Grand Power P11. I’ve adjusted the cant so that it’s leaning forward, which helps a bit in hiding the longer grip.
I’m 5′ 7″ and 175-180 lb. I tend to carry with a shirt over my firearm, usually a T-shirt or golf shirt that is untucked. Today, I’m straight from work (have to be tucked in, but I usually wear something over my shirt (sweater or bigger shirt or sweater). I think it’s important to know how I carry so that you know my carry experience. The belt is a Galco 1.5″. The holster is an Alien Gear Cloak Tuck 3.0.
Camera is at 3 o’clock position – holster is at 4 o’clock
Camera is at 4 o’clock position – holster is at 4 o’clock
Camera is at 5 o’clock position – holster is at 4 o’clock
Oh, and those pinky extension magazine base plates? I ordered some flat ones but to be honest, it’s a trivial concern…trust me, it’s not going to make all that much of a difference if you’re coming from a subcompact and are opting for a handgun of the size of the SP2022. I kid you not. I will more than likely return those mag base plates or sell them.
By the way, I ordered those flat mag base plates from RoCo Firearms. They are currently $12.50 each. I’m not sure if I posted their origins, but if not…
I have not carried this gun outside of the house (yet). It is more comfortable than I imagined (so far). The magazine is empty, though, but I don’t think a loaded mag will make much of a difference…it’s not the weight that will bother me (I’ve a good holster and belt). The bulkiness of the gun is probably all I need to get accustomed to.
I also received the Alien Gear holster shell for the Beretta I bought last night. I’m curious on how that will carry. In fact, I just might have an IWB bake-off between the Beretta and Sig. It will be interesting, since they both have similar manual of arms, both are polymer guns, both are similar in width, height, and weight (the Beretta is shorter, though, I believe).
This was the most agonizing decision I’ve made in quite awhile.
My birthday is approaching and I wanted to buy something nice but not too expensive. I’d considered a Sig 1911 as my next nice gun, but my wife isn’t going to sign off on a $800 purchase…maybe on my 50th birthday next year.
My choices were the Grand Power P1 or the Beretta PX4 Storm Compact.
I chose the Storm and bought it through Whittaker Guns for $429.
Why was this a difficult decision? I’d need to talk about the Grand Power and why I was considering it (as well as the thing that I don’t like about the company).
The pros:
As you well know, I currently conceal-carry a Grand Power P11 Mk12. This particular gun did not come with a decocker. New guns from Grand Power come with decockers and that includes the P1.
I currently use a P1 kydex holster when I carry my P11, so if I bought a P1, I’d already have a holster.
I currently use three P1 15-round mags with my P11 when I visit the range. If I bought a P1, which includes two magazines, I’d have five mags for this gun.
I basically already have all the gear to immediately start carrying a P1.
The con:
Grand Power stated in their forums that they will not sell the decocker parts to owners because they might be held liable if an owner did not install the part correctly and had an accidental (not negligent if there was an issue with the gun’s internals) discharge where someone was injured or killed.
Why do I have a problem with that? I’ll list the reasons:
They sell 99% of the internals for all their guns on the Eagle Imports web site. Most of those parts could cause an accidental discharge if installed incorrectly, and those have nothing to do with the safety/decocker. Yet they’ve no problem selling those parts and letting owners install them on their own.
Their competition sells such parts and let owners install those parts.
The mentality that they’re going to save us from ourselves is very much a liberal thought. This is also what drives such “technology” as loaded chamber indicators and magazine disconnects and both of those are training band-aids.
I don’t believe in any firearm being black-box-like (ie, don’t allow consumers to open the product). If they’re selling internal parts, how else do you get them into the firearm?
In lieu of them providing you the decocker parts, they suggest you spend $500+ to get a new GP pistol that would already have a decocker. Nope. Not going to happen.
I was a stout advocate of the P11 and it’s manufacturer up until this point. In fact, a large part of my Youtube content relates to the P11 and my experiences with it. I think it’s time to move on.
The depressing part of this is that I’ve spend a large amount of my time and training with the P11, so I’ll have to get familiar with another one of my handguns to replace my P11 as my EDC gun. An option is to continue to carry it but I just can’t swallow Grand Power’s attitude that they’ll allow us to replace any part but a safety/decocker (hell, they sell replacement safeties on their parts site!).
Currently, my options to replace the P11, if I want to stay with DA/SA, is with my Sig SP2022 or this new Beretta that will be shipped to me sometime this week. I’m more ready to carry the SP2022 than I am the PX4 at this point in time. I’m just waiting for some replacement mag base plates and a SP2022 shell form my Alien Gear holster. I have 4 mags for the SP2022. I have not a damned thing for the Storm, although I can easily get a N82 Tactical holster from a local gun shop (those are nice).
I can also carry the Bersa Thunder Plus that I have, but I HATE it’s decocker! With a passion. I can carry that with the safety off, if need be, and it’s a smaller gun to carry. Although it’s a .380, it is double-stack and holds 15+1. I have four mags for it and just got an N82 Tactical IWB holster for it. I just need to test some carry ammo and begin practicing with it.
Either way, I’ll be testing the carrying of the SP2022 and PX4 Storm.
Before I carry the Storm, though, I’m looking to replace the safeties with the stealth versions. As well, I’ll convert it to decocker-only.
I’m considering trying my SP2022 for everyday carry. I need to find magazine base plates that are less prominent, though. There’s one video on YouTube that states CZ P-07 magazine bast plates will fit, but I can’t find any place that sells them, so I tried the base plates of all the current guns in my safe and found one that fits! Which is it? The Ruger SR9C’s base plates fit almost perfectly. Glock base plates will also fit but the hole is in the wrong spot.
I now need to find a place that sells SR9C mag base plates, then I need to order a holster shell from Alien Gear so I can give carrying a try.
This gun is about as big as I’m willing to carry. It has a 3.9″ barrel, but is rather thick. The only way to determine how well it’ll carry is to try to carry it.
UPDATE: I can’t find ANY SR9 mag base plates on sale. My fall-back plan is the Glock base plates…I’ve found a pack of 6 for $40. Yes, this is rather expensive but I don’t think they’re cheap knock-off Chinese manufactured parts, either. I’d have to drill new holes into them, as well, which I don’t have a problem doing.
I’ve now shot over one thousand rounds through the Grand Power P11. It’s about time, too, as I’ve had the gun right at two years now.
How’s the wear/tear? Here’s a video showing the internals.
Some other things relating to this firearm:
Someone thought that because my P11 didn’t have a decocker, it was a Mk7. Mk12s were first produced without decockers. They are now sold with decockers but a Mk12 can either have a decocker or not.
Secondly, I’ve asked Grand Power and Eagle Imports if decockers can be retrofitted to those Mk12s that were sold without decockers. I didn’t get an answer but found it on their forums here. Apparently, GP/EI doesn’t want to deal with possible legal issues if someone buys the parts from the manufacturer, doesn’t install them correctly, and later experiences an unintentional discharge. If that’s the case, they shouldn’t want ANYONE messing with the internals…no one at all, yet they encourage people to do complete tear-downs of the firearm in every other case. If they’re that afraid of legal trouble, make the process stupid-simple for some parts. Beretta sells decockers on the side for their PX4 Storms knowing that everyday people will install them at home. Beretta is a far bigger business than Grand Power and have much more to lose when it comes to lawsuits, yet Beretta empowers people to customize their handguns. Glock does this as well, as does Ruger and Sig Sauer and Walther…and I can go on and on.
I do not believe in the black box mentality when it comes to such things. That means you’ll always be totally dependent upon the maker when it comes to asking a bit more of your firearm.
This pains me greatly because I’ve trained myself around the GP P11. That training was HARD work. As well, I’d grown fond of Grand Power and had planned on getting a P1. I still could (and a new P1 would have the decocker I’m asking for), but this is more about principles. Not offering parts for fear of lawsuits…that’s a cop out if I’ve ever heard one. I’ve heard such crap before in non-free states.
Because of this, I think I’m going to look at options to replace my P11. Some of you may think that this is a trivial thing and that it’s being blown out of proportion. IMO, there’s a bit of a Liberal scent to what GP stated (the “protect them from themselves and us” mentality).
So, I’m either going to start the process of making my P11 a safe queen and switching to a different EDC. I could even get a PX4 Storm Compact like I initially planned (and even sell the P11 to finance the Beretta).
