Category: P11

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380 Bersa decocker disconnect Grand Power magazine Mk12 P1 P11 Plus Thunder

Another Range Visit – 12/18/2016

I went to the range after work on 12/12.  I decided to bring my Metro Arm 1911 and the Bersa Thunder 380 Plus.  I only ended up firing the Bersa and my carry gun, the Grand Power P11.  I thought that 3 guns in a one-hour visit was too much, and I felt the need to be shooting more ammo out of the Grand Power since I’ve neglected to frequent the range.

I shot a total of 100 rounds out of the P11 (for a total of 816 rounds out of the gun).  There were no feed issues.

I shot 125 rounds out of the Bersa (for a total of 159).  There were no feed issues.

As with all my range sessions, I shoot at 7 yards.

First 15 rounds of the session, using the P11 (using GP P1 mags…bought 3 of them), 7 yards.
50 rounds, same target as above, same range, same gun.  Ammo is American Eagle ball FMJ, 115-grain.
Here’s the 2nd box of American Eagle, same gun, same distance.
Here’s the Bersa Thunder 380 Plus.  I’m not used to shooting this gun.  It feels too small for my hands (having issues with finger placement on the trigger since my hands are so big).  Taking my time, I can be accurate with it, though.  This is 15 rounds at 7 yards.
Here’s the whole 125 (100 rounds of  WWB flat-nosed FMJ and 25 rounds of Federal ball FMJ).  I couldn’t tear a ragged hole in the red like I can with the P11.  The P11 is built a lot better, though (better trigger and sights, less recoil reaching my hands).

Comparing the two guns, both are roughly the same size.  Roughly.  The P11 has the shorter barrel (3.3″, compared to the Bersa’s 3.5″ barrel).  The P11 is heavier (22.6 oz vs the Bersa’s 20.5).  Both are DA/SA guns, but the P11 has a very precise trigger in either mode.  The P11 fills my strong hand in a way that lets me put my trigger finger pad on the trigger.  The Bersa’s grip fits oddly in my hand, which hinders my finger placement.  I’ve to fumble around with the gun to get my finger pad on the trigger.  After awhile, I quit fumbling and accepted my fate that my hands may be too damned big for this gun’s grip.

Both guns have manual safeties.  The P11 has a frame safety that flicks up and down, similar to a 1911.  The Bersa has a slide safety that is counter-intuitive.  It works the opposite as what would be on a 1911.  As well, it is oddly placed, so that even if you train, you’re going to have to move your hand to get to it (unless you’ve super-small hands).  As well, the safety is very stiff.  Both of these issues mean that you’re probably going to have to train to engage or disengage the safety with the off-hand.  Also, the Bersa’s safety is also functioning as a decocker.  You can’t carry cocked and locked with the Bersa, since the decocker is also a safety and when you actuate the safety, you’re also decocking the gun.  Well…let me rephrase.  You can carry cocked but you’ll be doing it without the safety engaged with this gun, and that is unsafe unless you’ve trained for that; plus, you’d better have a good holster that protects the trigger.  Better to get a different gun if you’re looking to carry in a cocked and locked fashion…it won’t work well with this gun.

The Bersa also has a magazine disconnect.  This makes it very difficult to practice dry-firing, unless you keep the mag in the gun.  I’m thinking on removing the mag disconnect.  IMO, there are no cons in doing this (closet lawyers, please go back to your closet), especially if you’re already using sound safety practices…I mean, what’s keeping me from blowing a hole in the drywall with my guns that don’t have mag disconnects?  Good safety practices…

I thought that the Bersa would choke on the flat-nosed Winchester ammo.  I bought that ammo by mistake.  I’d heard from other Thunder 380 owners that these guns do not like flat-nosed ammo.  I saw a box of 100 at Walmart and it was labeled (on the box) as FMJ.  When I got home and opened the box, it was flat-nosed.  IMO, it should’ve been labeled as such on the box, especially since most sellers don’t accept returns on ammo.  But it didn’t choke on that ammo at all.  It ate it all without complaint.

Overall, the Bersa is a good enough gun.  I won’t be carrying it, though.  Because of what I’ve stated above, I’m unwilling to carry it.  This gun is not something I want to adjust to.  I’d have to find a way to thicken the grips so that I’d have less of an issue with trigger finger placement.  I’d also have to get used to the odd decocker (it’s in an odd position and training will not help that…then again, I can always carry decocked but with the safety disengaged…DA/SA guns can get away with this).

I’m still in love with the P11, although I’m thinking I might need more grip area with this gun as well.  The option would be to move to the P1 (maybe the P1 Ultra).  Grand Power markets that as a compact-sized gun with a 3.5″ barrel.  It also has swappable back straps (the P11 doesn’t have this…it should).  The P11’s grips are a bit slick, too.  Grip tape may be in the future of mine’s.  Oh, and Grand Power has also upgraded the P11 to have a decocker.  It is not a dedicated decocker…it’s a decocker/safety, similar to how Bersa implements it.  A dedicated decocker would’ve been better, IMO.  For now, I’ll stick to manually decocking (training is key — closet lawyers, go home).

I’m close to 1000 rounds out of the P11.  One range visit should put me over the 1000 round mark.  I know I’ve reported that it was experiencing FTFs/FTEs and failures to return to battery, but I’ve not seen that occurring since I’ve stopped using Remington ammo.  The issues of the past year were exclusively due to Remington ammo (and another gun choked on the same ammo in the same fashion).  I’ve also learned how/where to lube the gun.  There’s no wear on the gun’s internals, either.

Until next time…

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380 Bersa Grand Power P11 Plus T-100 Thunder Tristar

Range Visit with Bersa and Tristar

Yesterday was my birthday and I decided that I would go to the range after work.

There was a 40-minute waiting list and I almost ended up leaving.  That’s the first time I’ve ever been to Elite Shooting Sports where there was a backlog during the week day.  What’s cool is that they had  tablet kiosks to allow you to add yourself to the wait list and you’d be texted (to your phone) when a slot was available.

The staff was cordial and I know they were really busy, but none of the register attendants acted like they wanted to be there.  When you’re buying merchandise, service, or just space/time, the worst thing is to interact with employees that act like they don’t like what they’re doing.  This is the second time I’ve noticed this…was hoping it wouldn’t turn into a trend.

Anyways…

I decided to shoot the Bersa Thunder 380 Plus first, since it was something different for me (blow-back design and .380 caliber).  Man, is that thing accurate!  Recoil is next to nothing, too.  I dumped 3 rounds into each target, 7 yards away, semi-rapid fire, from upper right to upper left, lower right to lower left, then center.  The first shot was dead on the red (as well as being a DA shot), but the following two flew a bit upward.  Then next target was a bit wide, but I still touched the red at least once.  The rest of the groups tightened up significantly as I navigated the targets.

I shot a total of thirty-four rounds before I put the Bersa away.  Since I only had one magazine, I stopped shooting it.  I’ve ordered 3 new OEM magazines from MidwayUSA.com (was marked down at $27 each but has since been up-priced at $49)

I then focused on the Tristar T-100 9mm for the rest of the range session.  One thing I neglected to do was manually decock the gun for a DA shot.  I’ve a feeling I wouldn’t have hit red in DA like I did with the Thunder, as the DA trigger is long and strong (much longer and stronger than what I’m used to).  But I did a mag dump in the center target as a first date:

I started off fine but as I sped up my follow-on shots, my group began to lose composure.  That’s not the gun’s fault…it’s mine.  I was treating it like the Bersa since the Bersa was the gun I was shooting prior to picking up the T-100.  Recoil was significantly more than the Bersa, but I was all over the target center before I upped the pace.  This gun is just as easy to shoot as the Bersa, because of it’s low bore axis and it’s non-traditional rail setup (it’s using the CZ design).

I then tried to focus on small groups (using the same target):

The groups are very tight, especially upper left.  The lower right had a flyer, but the two that landed were almost on top of each other and near center-mass.

For the T-100, I used the same Remington 147-grain flat-nosed FMJ that choked my Grand Power P11.  It ate 150 of that make/model without one failure.  One round had a slightly crinkled lip but I wanted to see if the round would still chamber and fire without issue…it did.  I expected nothing less, as I know that CZs aren’t designed to be as tight as GP’s products.  The gun frame was warm to the touch when I was done with it (it’s a metal-framed gun), but not uncomfortably so.  For the Bersa, I used Federal 95-grain FMJ, and there were no failures.

I also fired some spare ammo from my GP P11 (8 rounds of Winchester Personal Protection JHP that had been chambered several times…they needed to be used or disposed of, so I used them).  There were no issues whatsoever.  I neglected to bring non-Remington 9mm so I couldn’t fire the P11 any more than that.  Plus, I only had the lane for an hour and I was out of time after firing 8 rounds from the P11.  I need more range time with the P11 since it is my carry gun.  Of those 8 rounds, only half hit the target.  I found I was slapping the trigger, but as soon as I figured that out, the rest were all in the red.  The P11 doesn’t seem to be as forgiving with heavy-handedness, and it’s SA trigger is very light.  I’d have done better if I’d have had more time to adjust to the switch-up of handguns.

I had fun with the two new guns, especially the Tristar.  I’ll probably shoot it again the next range visit.

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DA/SA decocker GP Grand Power kydex manual P1 P11 Red Hill Tactical safety

GP P11 – Ready To Conceal Carry!

I finally found an inside waistband holster for my P11.  I cheated.  How?  I couldn’t find any for the P11 anywhere and didn’t feel like begging for any holster makers to make one for me.  I didn’t feel like trying to make one myself, either.  I searched and found that many holsters for the P1 are available for sale.  The P1 is the next size up from the P11…it’s the compact version of the Grand Power K-100, which is a full-sized handgun.  The P11 is the sub-compact version of the K-100.  They are identical, feature-wise.  The only differences are the length of the grips and the length of the slides.  So, I bought a P1 holster thinking that the P11 would fit inside without issue.  The holster was kydex, so it was important that the slides and features be pretty much identical, placement-wise.  I wasn’t disappointed, as it was almost as if this holster was made for the P11.  The slide length of the P1 is 3.6″ while the P11’s slide is 3.3″, so I had .3″ extra between the tip of the handgun and the tip of the holster.

Some issues that I describe in the video is that the holster was molded with a P1 with it’s slide safety disabled.  I’d thought the GP DA/SA handguns were designed to be carried cocked & locked (one in the chamber with the hammer cocked and safetied).  The guns are DA/SA without a decocker, so if an owner wants to carry his GP in DA mode, he/she will have to lower the hammer on a chambered round (ie, decocking manually).  This is not a trivial procedure and if done hastily or wrong, a round could be negligently discharged.  I’ve been practicing several different manual decocking techniques and will eventually be ready to carry with one in the chamber in DA mode, but for now, I’m enabling the safety and carrying cocked and locked.  While this causes a slight fitment issue with the kydex while the gun is holstered, it doesn’t cause any safety issues…it just looks a tad bit odd, is all.

I’ll eventually have to buy some extra 12-round magazines for the P11.  I’ve two right now, but I want several more so that I can practice at the range without having to stop and reload the two mags after they’re empty.  They are not cheap but I will not buy cheap CZ mags to alter…I’d rather do this right and just buy the expensive mags.

This gun carries good in the kydex holster.  It feels lighter than my other holsters (Alien Gear IWB Cloak Tuck 3.0s) and it is certainly less complicated/busy.  It is easy to clip to my belt.  I can quickly get dressed, grab my gun, and install it on my belt while walking around the house.  I can’t do that with my Alien Gear holsters.  The con is that I’ve to wear t-shirts under my shirts now, because the Kydex doesn’t shield my body from the gun’s rough edges (part of the slide, grip, and hammer sometimes dig into my side.  This might also be a good reason to start carrying in DA mode…the manual safety is protected, but that part of the gun is what is rubbing against my body, so I’m thinking that it would be safer to just have the gun in DA mode.

I bought the holster from Red Hill Tactical.  I’ve visited their site in the past but this is the first time I’ve actually bought something from them.  This holster vendor was recommended by the Grand Power forums.

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ammo battery failure Grand Power P11 Remington sight radius Springfield XD

Range Visit – XD Mod 2 & Grand Power P11

I spent an hour at the range last night and shot 130 rounds out of my XD and 60 rounds out of the Grand Power.

It felt so good to not divide my attention between more than 2 guns, although I did want to shoot one of the 1911s.

I started with the XD first and immediately put 9 of 10 rounds in a close grouping.

7 yards out, using Remington UMC 115-grain JHP

The thing about the Mod 2 is that it shoots extremely well for a subcompact 9mm, as the sight radius of such guns is very small.  This gun still has a small sight radius, but the recoil and snappiness is somewhat negated by the Grip Zone texturing of the grips.  The front fiber optic helps, especially since I’ve problems focusing on the front sight (I wear corrective lenses).

As I shot five different targets, my groupings got progressively worse.  I’m pretty sure it was due to incorrect finger placement on the trigger and not being smooth on the trigger, as I began to impact left of aim.  Still, it was fun to challenge myself.

I also fired the XD better with the shorter magazine (vs. using the longer magazine that has the mag sleeve).  Don’t ask me why that was the case.

The Grand Power was acting wonky.  It didn’t jam or fail to extract, but it may’ve been failing to feed due to a dirty feed ram, as the gun was failing to fully go into battery after expending and ejecting a round.  It was an intermittent issue, though, because it didn’t happen every magazine bu when it did, it was almost back-to-back failures to return to battery.

The weapon was clean when I brought it to the range.  The ammo I was shooting must’ve been extremely dirty to cause issues between 1 and 60 rounds…in fact, the gun was extremely dirty after that range visit…more than I expected for 60 rounds.  The gun was lubed, and I made sure the pivot point on the rotating barrel had lubrication.

I don’t think it was the mags that were the issue.  When I racked the gun slowly, I didn’t notice any binding.  The only thing I can think of is that the feed ramp got dirty quickly and was hampering the feeding of the next round, which would keep the slide from fully going forward.


Possible causes:

  • Ammo that doesn’t have enough powder.
  • Dirty ammo that gets the feed ramp really dirty.
  • Limp wristing (I highly doubt that’s what happened, but I list it anyways, just in case I AM limp wristing).
  • Feed ramp doesn’t like hollow point ammo.
  • Feed ramp needs to be broken in (I doubt this, but read that someone had an issue with a ramp being too polished).

UPDATE:  Well…look at this  –>  http://www.handgunforum.net/beretta/30881-failure-feed-px4-storm-compact-9mm.html.  This looks similar to my bullet list above…looks like I am on the right track.  How does this relate to my P11?  Well, the small Beretta PX4 Storms have rotating barrels as well.  It seems that these type guns might not like lighter ammo and might be prone to limp-wristing as well.

Of the two guns, I fired the XD better.  That wasn’t the case the last time I took the P11 to the range.  Blame the failures to go into battery.

I did not get any video footage, as my camera wasn’t charged before I left for the range.

I fired 100 rounds of Remington UMC 115-grain JHP, 20 rounds of Remington UMC 115-grain FMJ, and 10 rounds of Remington HTP 115-grain +P.

I’m looking forward to the next range visit so I can put more rounds through the XD and become more proficient with it.  I’m not quite looking forward to re-experiencing issues with the P11, though.

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1911 carry CCW concealed Grand Power mag blocks magazines P11 SP2022 VA XD

Received my CCW Permit!

I submitted for my Virginia CCW on 20 February.  I received the permit in the mail on 28 February.  That’s eight (8) days turn-round!  Yes, I knew the VA process is simple in comparison to states such as California, but I’ve never heard of anyone getting their VA permit 8 days after submitting their application – don’t take that as a complaint, though…I’m VERY happy.

So, I’m now legal to carry concealed.  The studying of the laws and reading of others’ experiences has been ongoing and I’ll continue to do both until I become a CA resident.  My immediate tasks are to obtain several good in-waistband holsters.  This is difficult to do because I never considered which firearm I’d be carrying.  For now, I think I’ll carry my 1911s, but I also want to carry my XD subcompact, so I’ve ordered two IWB holsters for both the 1911s and the XD.  I also ordered an extra shell so that I can carry my SP2022.  Why did I pick these guns?  Because the 1911s have slide safeties, the XD has it’s grip safety, and the SP2022 has it’s DA/SA trigger (which I’m probably more acquainted with than the others’ safety mechanisms).  I’ll more than likely focus on carrying whichever is the least difficult to carry.  I’d rather have some type of safety on the guns I’ll be carrying, so that means I won’t be carrying the Glock 19 or the P320C (for now, at least).  You might not agree with the reasoning, but the choice is mine alone to make.

I ordered the Alien Gear Cloak Tuck 2.0 IWB.  I actually ordered two of them, as Alien Gear is having a two holster deal.  I ordered two holsters and an extra shell for $67.  It will be 4-6 weeks before I see those holsters, though.  If I can find something local at a LGS, Gander Mountain, Bass Pro, Dick’s, or even Walmart, I’ll be lucky.

I also want to try to carry my other subcompact, the Grand Power P11, but I can’t find any holsters designed for it.  If I can find a decent generic holster that fits the P11 satisfactorily, I’ve the feeling that that particular gun would be ideal for me to carry.

Obtaining my VA CCW permit makes it more difficult to wrap my head around moving to CA.  We still remind ourselves that we can move to a state neighboring CA if we decided our liberties are being limited too much by CA.

I still have to order magazine blocks for the guns.  I’ll have to hack existing mag blocks for the GP P11, but that shouldn’t be too difficult.  If I find that they’re actually too difficult for me to hack, I’ll order 2-3 10-round mags from Eagle Imports.  My wife’s Ruger has one 10-round mag and one 12-round mag.  The 12-round mag has to go.  Her task is to find someone that’s willing to take it in exchange for their 10-round mag.  If it’s not gone by the time we’re ready to go to CA, I’ll either mail it to my parents or, worse case, throw it away…I’m not going to jail over a mag that my wife doesn’t want to get rid of.