I wanted a place to discuss my handguns and firearms in general. Everyone seemingly has lots to say about guns, so I promise you this won't be a rant blog.
I’ve been to the range twice with the Tisas Carry DS9.
I’ll share some information about the first range visit. I also suspected some of the things we discussed in my last post would be apparent during the first range visit.
The trigger had issues. The gun initially had a thick walled trigger. While the trigger itself wasn’t heavy, it wasn’t light either, so that’s a wash. The trigger wall was stiff, but I shot maybe 130 rounds from the gun, so the wall softened a bit. As well, the trigger is now lighter by 1 lb.
Between the trigger’s issues and the sights, I was having issues hitting where I aimed. I shot low (90 degrees low) with every shot — not low left, but directly low. I’m not sure how to use the U-notch sights, but I’m thinking they’re off by a bit, at least.
The gun didn’t hiccup at all during the first range visit. I shot a mix of ammo, some being HP, some being SD HP, and some being FMJ. The gun is flat-shooting, too.
When I got home from the first range visit, I sat while watching TV and kept racking the gun and pulling the trigger to get that thick wall to wear-in as quickly as possible.
When I went to the range next (two days later), I shot 187 rounds. Quite a bit of ammo was shot, some HP, some SD ammo, and a lot of range ammo. I had one fail to feed one one HP (I think it was Winchester range JHP). I put it back in the magazine and it feed and shot successfully.
The gun also shot a lot better, probably due to the trigger breaking in. Also, I man-handled the gun, as the first range visit, I was sloppy with gun control (recoil management and probably trigger control). My grouping were MUCH better this range visit.
I now have 317 rounds through the gun. The gun has yet to be cleaned, which says a lot, because I’ve looked in the gun and it’s pretty filthy. The rails were overly lubricated, which may have helped. I may clean it tomorrow, as I’m not intentionally trying to induce filth-related failures.
I also published a video. I’ll be producing a longer duration video soon. The short duration one below lacks some information (I had to make it fit into a 15 minute timeframe).
It is almost 1 o’clock AM and I was viewing availability of the new Tisas double stack 1911s. I was watching to see if I could find low priced variants, and also was waiting to see reviews of them – there are not all that many, currently. I did not intend to purchase until I noticed that the prices were creeping upward. As well, most places that had them earily in the week had sold out. I decided to buy now.
I bought a black Carry model. I’d been studying the Duty variant but none of those have been available…I can get one of those later, if need be. I was also looking at the MAC DS varaint, but didn’t feel like spending $900 on a 1911 (even though that price is below MSRP).
Note that the Tisas will be MIM-less (all but the recoil spring plug). Also, the gun comes with 2 mags. As well, the gun is optics-ready and the cover plate does not have the rear sight attached (which is great).
I’m excited about this gun, as it will be my second legit 2011. I saw some Prodigys that were marked way down from MSRP, but those were still $1100. I also looked at Apollo 11. This gun also undercuts the LFA Apollo 11 by a fair margin ($300) and comes with an extra mag, as well as having no MIM.
I’m happy with my single stacked Tisas and know they’re reliable, so I decided to give their 2011 a try.
This time, I bought from TheGunDock.com, mainly due to their lower pricing.
As with every gun purchase, I’ll document my journey with this gun.
UPDATE (2/10/2024): I waited two days for the gun to ship, but my FFL hasn’t yet sent it’s FFL information to the place I purchased the gun. They sent it to me by mistake. The gun store requires the FFL to send the info, not the person buying the gun. Until my FFL can follow the process, shipping won’t occur. I asked them to resend the info again, but it was late in the afternoon and I don’t think they saw my email. I may get the gun by the end of next week, IF my FFL clears up their mistake either tomorrow or Monday.
So, I was checking Reddit today and saw a post that Tisas had listed a double-stacked 1911 on their website product list. Within an hour, there were like 5-6 other posts (in the r/1911 subreddit).
I decided to check the product page and was shocked. I thought they’d produced a Para-patterned 1911, but they actually produced THREE (3) 2011-patterned 1911s. They producted a 5″ variant, a 4.25″ variant, and a 5″ variant of their Night Stalker SF.
Not only that, but typical recent budget 2011s offer optics cuts that remove the rear sights. The Tisas variants will allow the rear sights to stay in place when using an optic. They’re also using 1/3rd co-witness of the rear sight through the mounted optic.
What’s the difference between Para- and 2011-patterned handguns? Para-patterned guns have the grips a permanent part of the frame. The frame and grip are one piece. 2011-patterened handguns have modular polymer grips that are separate from the frame. Many folks confuse Para-patterned double-stacked 1911s as 2011s, when there’s a distinctive difference.
Anyways, here are two videos: one of the 5″ Duty DS and the other of the 4.25″ Carry DS.
UPDATE (2/8/2024): I’ve removed the YouTube videos from this post, as the publisher marked them as private. It’s a bit annoying, because the publisher was Tisas.
I’ve been keeping a running tally of notes after visiting the range – keep in mind that I’ve not been to the range with this particular gun in quite a while (2022). Here’s the latest version of my notes:
UPDATE 1:
Range photos with detailed captions are at https://photos.app.goo.gl/yrLbWQNMmDjgJCzV8. Note: I’m not sure if Reddit will choke on Google’s URL shortener – I’ve had problems with it in the past.
I brought 2 Wilson Combat mags with me, the two that the gun came with, and 1 ACT mag from another 1911. The ACT mag choked the gun once, and I knew it would be problematic because it’s been acting up the last few range visits (ie, it wasn’t an ammo issue). I bought another WC mag from the range store – it will replace the ACT mag. I will keep the ACT mag in case I need to scavenge parts from it.
The B45R loved PMC Bronze 230-gr FMJ and I shot 50 rounds of it (this ammo always feels peppy). The other ammo I used was International 155-gr frangible ammo. That ammo is crappy but it never choked the B45R. My Metro Arms hates it. I also noticed slide slowdown (an indication of low powder charge) but only when shooting it out of the Metro Arms…I didn’t notice any of that with the B45R. I shot 100 rounds of the International ammo.
I bought some G10 grips to replace the cheap-feeling grips that came with the gun. They work very well, and I expected nothing less (all of my other 1911s are using G10s).
Issues:
The WC mags will sometimes hang up in the mag well. It seems that the magazine catch/release is blocking insertion. If I hammer up on the mag, it blasts past but smacks into the upper portion of the gun (that’s probably not a good thing). If I actuate the release button a tad, the mag is allowed past. I’m hoping this issue will go away. This only happens with the WC mags. I’ve three 7-round Mecgar mags on the way here and they should arrive tomorrow. I’ll see if those get hung up. UPDATE:Found someone else reporting the same issue here – replaced the OEM mag release with a WC mag release; tested both the WC mags and GI mags – both can now be inserted without issue.
This is more of a non-issue for me but has been an issue for some folks. The grip panel bushings have been said to be “off” and will not accept non-OEM screws. I had no problem using the screws provided to me by Coolhandgear.com to install their grips. I tried two sets of differing screws and had no issues.
I’m absolutely loving this gun. My target gun was a Springfield Armory but I had a very difficult time deciding exactly what I wanted and then had a difficult time finding them in stock. So, I did research and decided to try the SDS 1911s. This gun hits way above it’s weight…it is very much comparable to a Springfield Armory Garrison (but railed). The B45R was well under $500, but has a forged frame (what other non-GI 1911s are in this price range that offer both forged frames and slides?). I basically stole a great 1911. I also don’t have any issues buying foreign/Turkish guns. I’m a 10 year military combat veteran, so I’m as patriotic as any self-proclaimed patriot, and have probably sacrificed more. ALL of my 1911s are non-US and I’ve Caniks and Tristars as well, one being my CC gun. I’ve no problem with any non-US-made guns.
The plan is to maybe change/fit a silver barrel bushing but maybe in 6 months or so.
UPDATE 2:
I visited the range tonight and put more rounds through the 1911 – 169 rounds to be exact. 150 of that was PMC Bronze FMJ and 19 was Remington HTP 185-gr JHP. There’s now a total of 319 rounds through the gun.
One JHP failed to feed but the gun is very dirty now (haven’t cleaned it since the day I received it). As well, it choked when using one of the three GI mags I bought – the round was the first in the mag. No, 19 JHP rounds isn’t much but good JHP 45ACP ammo isn’t exactly cheap, so that’s going to have to suffice for now.
I decided to test it at 12 yards out. I usually don’t shoot at distances longer than 12 yards. The gun is accurate, even in my hands (although there were flyers).
The gun is tearing up my hand at the beavertail – still trying to determine how. I’m being pinched badly at the webbing of my hand where the two skin textures meet. I’ll use gloves the next range visit. UPDATE: I believe it is the back of the right-side (ambi) safety that is rubbing my hand raw. It isn’t sharp but isn’t rounded either…over long periods of time, it’s an issue. I may look into getting a one-sided safety.
I’ve a Wilson Combat magazine release on the way. That should fix mag insertion problem with the WC and GI mags. No longer an issue.
UPDATE 3:
I’ve shot 429 rounds from my SDS Imports DB45R 1911, thus far. Since I’ve been curious about it’s carry capabilities, I’ve been trying to shoot JHP from it, initially with mixed results.
I initially shot Remington HTP 185-gr JHP, which generated several failures to feed (FTFs).
Federal LE 185-gr JHP was used, as well (maybe 25 rounds), which also generated some FTFs.
International Cartridge Corporation’s (ICC) 45ACP 155-gr frangible hollow points were used. For the most part, these shot without issue. That ammo can be used as defense ammo.
I also fired 20 rounds of Underwood ($$$) 45ACP +P 230-gr JHP. 8 of the 20 rounds generated FTFs. I used Wilson Combat mags with this ammo. Since this ammo is expensive and since it generated so many FTFs, I will stop shooting that ammo through the DB45R. Once I suspect that the gun will shoot it without FTFs, I’ll test the ammo again.
Inceptor ARX 118-gr defense ammo (non-JHP) was used, using the WC mag. There were no FTFs.
I shot PMC Bronze 185-gr JHP (non-SD ammo), using the WC mag.. There were no FTFs.
Hornady Critical Defense 185-gr JHP was shot through the gun, using the WC mag.. There were no FTFs.
So, I now know that I can use the following ammo as viable ammo for self defense: ICC 155-gr FJHP Inceptor ARX 118-gr PMC Bronze 185-gr JHP Hornady Critical Defense 185-gr JHP
In my view, the ammo problems are more than likely due to projectile ogive dimensions as well as hollow point size. If it were an issue with the gun, ALL the JHP I tested would be generating FTFs. There are no specification standards on ogive or projectile dimensions in today’s ammo market, so it’s difficult to make a gun 100% reliably eat all mass-produced ammo, and 1911s aren’t Glocks, so….
I plan to continue to shoot the PMC Bronze JHP ammo as range ammo, to continue the break-in process of the DB45R 1911.
I’ve started my Christmas 2023 vacation this week. Several things are on my agenda as far as firearms are concerned.
I’ve to send my SAS II UL back to Bul Armory for them to fix an issue that I couldn’t resolve. The problem is that I can fire the gun without disengaging the grip safety. I did replace the trigger shoe with a flat shoe. That replacement required me to remove the over-travel screw, but I adjusted it properly. At least, I think I did. I’ve done the same to my other 1911s and none of the other guns are experiencing the issue. I don’t typically test to see if my 1911s will fire with the grip safety disengaged, so I don’t know why I tried it this time. BA sent me a shipping label so that I can send it back to them. I’ve boxed up the gun and will ship it out tomorrow. I’ve removed the optic and reinstalled the rear irons. I also included an empty mag (they asked for it to be sent with the gun). I’ve no idea how long they’ll have the gun and customer support is hit/miss as far as being good is concerned.
I haven’t shot my Tisas Duty in a while. Someone asked in r/1911 about extended reviews of the gun. I stated that no one has been posting about the gun, other than after one range visit of shooting. So, tomorrow, I plan to visit the range with the Tisas. I went to Cabelas and found some somewhat cheap ammo. I bought three boxes of 50 rounds each. The whole reason I stopped shooting it was because 45ACP was expensive at the time. I’ll bring an extra box from home (I’ve a box of Herters JHP too). I’ve some Underwood +P too, but that’s expensive, and after a while, it actually hurts to shoot it. The jarring is pretty ruthless, at 1200 FPS. The plan is to try to shoot all 200 rounds. I’ve to remember to bring all the different mags I have.
While the SAS II UL is out for repair, I’m carrying the Alpha Foxtrot S15. I’d checked to see if the S15 would fit in my Tenicor holster (when I’d first bough the gun), but I’d never actually worn the holster with that gun. It EASILY carries. While I knew the grip was thin, it’s easy to hide – much easier than the SAS II UL’s grip. What I’m not used to is it’s heft. It’s heavier – not by a lot, but it’s noticeable.
As soon as the SAS II UL gets returned to me, I probably should ask Alpha Foxtrot to look at that gun, as the ramp frame insert sometimes moves. Once that has been fixed, I’m probably going to find a reputable place that’ll make the gun optics-ready.
I’ll update you all on the status of the Bul Armory once it is returned to me.
I usually try to buy a gun a year, specifically around this time. Last year, I bought a RIA 10mm 5″ double-stacked 1911 and Canik TP9 Elite SC. The year before that, I bought nothing. The year prior to that, which was the year I started making this an annual experience, I bought the PSA AK-V and AK-P.
I’d planned on getting another AK and had my eye on a 5.56/.223 variant but had a number of problems committing to another AK.
For one, higher end AKs are difficult to find in stock and when they are in stock, they quickly become out-of-stock.
Secondly, I’ve one pistol caliber AK pistol, as well as an AK pistol chambered in 7.62×39. I also have two AK rifles (both in 7.62×39). I’d wanted a 5.56 AK but couldn’t decide on if I wanted yet another long gun or pistol chambered in that caliber – I have both types already. I wouldn’t have cared but when I asked on the AK subreddit, the absolutely stupid replies back soured me to any AK, so I ended up not no longer wanting an AK.
I then decided to focus on a higher end 1911, either a mid-grade Sig or Springfield Armory. In fact, I wasn’t really caring on a particular 1911 maker. I just wanted the product to have a forged frame, slide, and barrel that was 5″ max with a traditional barrel (ie, no bull barrel). Price was $1000 max with a focus on lower price. I couldn’t find much that was in stock. I saw a LOT of Springfield Armory Garrisons but I wasn’t liking the sights on those (I wanted fully adjustable front and rear sights).
I’d been looking for weeks and couldn’t find much. I even looked outside of 1911s (looked at Sig’s P320 AXG Classic and Equinox – they were all expensive as hell). I’d also looked for the Springfield Armory SA-35 but they’re definitely out of stock everywhere.
I then decided to look at any 1911 that had forged slides and frames. I became focused on the IWI Desert Eagle 1911s until I saw that their frames are cast (precision cast but still cast).
Then I remembered that some of the Turkish 1911s had forged frames and slides. I focused on SDS and Tisas (SDS imports Tisas, I believe).
I found one that was discounted to $439 and tried to buy it but changed my mind right before I committed to the purchase because the website seemed fishy (it was http://www.2agunshow.com). The website seemed “sketchAF” and the price was super cheap, undercutting the next lowest 1911 of the same make/model by close to $40. Also when I tried to select an FFL at my location 5-10 miles round me, none of the usual FFLs showed in the results…it was very odd (maybe affiliated with dealers if it wasn’t actually sketch).
This gun was also listed at $432 here but went out of stock maybe 10 min after I saw it..
I ended up going to that next lowest priced gun of the same type and paying a bit extra for it (after researching the website/store first to ensure it was a legit site for regular buyers). I bought it.
A question that someone is going to ask, either at my Youtube channel or here, or even in the back of his mind when reading this: How in the hell did you go from Springfield Armory to a cheap Turkish gun?
That’s an easy question to answer. A true gun enthusiast will be acutely aware of Turkey’s history of gun-making and this particular brand, which is Tisas. Most uneducated folks think “cheaply made with non-quality materials and bad fitment/finish” when anyone mentions guns made outside of the US and 1st World countries in the EU. It’s a generally ignorant mentality. I’m not even sure Turkey can be considered a 3rd Word country. It’s like folks are thinking Afghanistan when thinking of Turkey! Folks familiar with Tisas-made 1911s know that they are quality. There are many models of US-made 1911s that are still using cast frames and many $1000+ 1911s are still using MIM parts. This particular 1911 has a forged slide, barrel (which even extremely cheap and shoddily built 1911s will have), and a forged frame. I don’t think ANY 1911s currently under production and under $500 have all three of those forged parts, with the exception of Tisas 1911s. Not only that, the fitment and finish of this gun equates more to $900-1000 1911s. If someone handled and even fired this firearm (but was withheld the make and country of origin), I bet they’d heap praises on it. And if they were made aware of the material makeup of the firearm, they’d further pile on the praises. When people know it’s from Turkey, they are immediately blinded and will actively refuse to further consider the gun. When I see this, I immediately have a general idea of their thought processes. “Buy only American products.” “Why would you buy something cheaply made when, for a few dollars more, you can have a Springfield or Sig?” And, it sometimes gets uglier: “Why would you support terrorism by buying a Turkish gun?”
Turkey is a NATO partner and the company named Tisas isn’t operated by the Turkish government. Yeah, no one likes Ergodan, but that doesn’t mean all companies in Turkey have Ergodan’s mentality.
While the price of the gun may be budget-minded, the makeup of the gun itself is pretty nice. I’m getting forged parts and the gun has little MIM parts (while all Springfield Armory 1911s are full of MIM). The Tisas 1911 was the better gun.
Also, going cheaper leaves me with some money for more ammo and options to upgrade the sights (I’m pretty sure the gun will come with contrast non-adjustable sights).
I will also probably buy another gun too, since I originally wanted to spend up to $1K. It will more than likely be an AR pistol chambered in 9mm – that’s something I don’t have. I will almost certainly buy a blemished one from PSA. I’ll post more about that later.
UPDATE (12/13/2023): The only MIM part in all Tisas 1911s currently produced is the recoil spring plug, and that can easily be replaced with a non-MIM part, without the need for fitting that part. They started doing that late 2022, I believe. Pricing has crept up, but Tisas are still the only guns under $1000 that have no MIM.
